Thursday, March 20, 2014

THERMONUCLEAR UKRAINE WILL BE OURS!!!


I got into a long and involved debate with a random Russian nationalist guy (honestly, I don't know what he is but he sounded like one) in the comment section on Forbes.com blog about Russian economy and demographics.

Yes, I am sorry readers... I decided to post it here.

Why?

Why?

WHY?!?

"Why?" you ask. Well, because I wrote so much that I didn't want it to just linger in obscurity.

I mean it will still linger in obscurity on my blog here.

But... THIS IS MY OBSCURITY. DO YOU UNDERSTAND? IT'S MY OBSCURITY NOW!!!

Anyway... I'm sorry loyal reader. Try to enjoy it, it has some good stuff.

***

Ivan:

Russia is the world’s 8th largest economy. Russia lags behind the western world but compared to the world at large, Russians enjoy an above-average standard of living- especially in large cities where aside from traffic and lack of space, many live middle-class lives.

This is not to say that all is great in the land of Rus but things just aren't as dire. It appears that the majority in the West just see Russia as it was in the 1990′s with a clever and sinister autocrat slapped on top.

I read a lot of comments where people found it incomprehensible that any Crimean would actually want to be a part of Russia not realizing that Russian GDP per capita is more than twice that of Ukraine, all other ethnic and historical allegiances aside.

As a liberal Russian-America, I don’t love Putin or wholly buy into his narrative of Russophobia but I am also SO fucking tired of people unable to see shades of grey when it comes to Russia. Many morons -even educated ones- are unable to comprehend that Michael Sakashvilli started the Georgian war in 2008 because they are so trapped in the rummaging Russian bear narrative that they got from Rocky movies.

They don’t understand that the pro-Western people in Ukraine aren’t speaking for the whole country and that in a Gallup poll done at the end of last year 56% of Ukrainians saw more harm than good from USSR breakup.

I am not a Soviet apologist or a Putin supporter but when you are hammered again and again with the same trite sanctimonious garbage about Putin being a Stalinist or the next Hitler, I do want to vomit.

Russia retook a piece of land that belonged to it since the 18th century and that has a Russian majority from a country with a collapsing economy in a midst of a revolution and yet -it appears- that most westerns are befuddled by the fact that most Crimeans are celebrating this fact.

Yeah, lets have a new Cold War over it. Why not? It seems for many that would be easier than actually parting with their stereotypes and using their brain cells to develop a new view of Russia- not as an enemy or a friend but just as country with its struggles and successes, not willing to have its historical territory (that ended up across the border through an accident of history) be ruled by a revolutionary government with members in it who worship a Nazi-collaborator who slaughtered Poles, Russians and Jews who stood in the way of his ethnically pure Ukraine.

The America I know where a third of the country equates their president with Stalin for reforming a healthcare system wouldn’t put up with this crap either.

My opponent, Ed Reins:

Russia is #5 in GDP by the PPP count. The nominal rating you are using is meaningless.

Also, you are naive thinking that Russia is portrayed negatively in US media only because of the Cold War stereotypes. US and EU are there to enforce the new world order, the total domination by US and European financial institutions and corporations, and Russia is not a vassal of these entities.

Russia can inflict a lot more damage on them than the other way around. I hope that Putin elects the way of confrontations, because a brute force is the only thing such primitive people as Americans understand.

Another important point to remember is that Americans are very different from all other people on the face of the Earth. They pledge an allegiance to the flag every day at schools, from K to 12. Eventually, they stop thinking what they are saying and go into a hypnotic altered state of conbsciousness. After a few repetitions, this creates a center in their brain which is responsive to suggestions when similar words as in the pledge are said.

This makes them very vulnerable to a patriotic propaganda and essentially turns them into sheep obedient to their political leaders. This is somewhat true of many totalitarian regimes, but US brainwashing has outperformed them all. Americans are the least thinking people of all, their Bachelor’s degree is way below a Russian High School Diploma.

Ivan:

Then I’m glad I completed six and a half grades of school in the Russian education system so focused on cultivating independent thinking before being moved to America and having my brain washed repeatedly with Yankee collectivism and chauvinism culminating in my acquisition of a useless and inferior bachelor degree in Political Science from an American university that (I now discover) puts me below a high school graduate from Magadan.

No, I’m not naive to believe that no sinister propaganda campaign is required for people to have double standards. Double standards is the dominating way of thinking around the world, touching on everything from international law in Crimea to religion and driving etiquette.

Though I am in favor of Crimea becoming a part of Russia (because most people there want that and the new Ukrainian govt in a midst of a revolution and having 1/4 of it ruled by a neo-Nazi party, Svoboda, has little to offer these people aside from threats to their language and maybe an oligarch for a governor like the ones they installed in east Ukraine) it is apparent to me that Russia also has it’s share of double standards.

I’ve been watching Russian state television online with its gleeful emphasis on the West’s hypocrisy relative to Kosovo and saw Vladimir Putin’s speech (which was not bad overall) where he even went so far as to cite American legal argument over Kosovo to international law court hearing the case for Kosovo's independence for Serbia.

From a logical point of view, every time Russia points an accusing finger at the West over Kosovo, it is also pointing out its own contradiction. Russia insisted on the sacredness of Serbia’s borders and that no part of it can proclaim independence without the consent of Belgrade- regardless of what the local population thought.

Now the voice of the Crimean majority (and some visiting Cossacks) must be heard. A logical approach to international law would now demand that Russia recognize Kosovo as an independent state… though I’m not holding my breath.

Finally, you may view America as a nation of morons, that is your prerogative. Having lived here since I was 13, I disagree. Like Russia, America is a large nationalistic country that sees itself as being exceptional. As in Russia, this belief has it’s pluses and minuses, it leads to both a continuum of innovation and arrogant miscalculations.

People enjoy repetitive activities since early childhood when they bang two blocks with similar effect until mama brings them borscht (or some inferior collectivist Yankee burgers and fries, if they had the misfortune to be born in America).

When those kids grow up and get caught up in politics, this lust for repetition translates to people saying the same banal shit over and over in different ways. “Obama is a week” “Putin is a thug” “Russia must be punished” “America is an arrogant empire.”

I think intelligence and independent thinking rests in seeing the shades of gray.

The very technology you are using to convey your idea that Americans are some of the dumbest people on earth has been either invented (internet) or invented an perfected (computers) in America. But whatever, maybe you’ll make a case that some Russian scientist in Yeltsin’s Russia came up with the internet before the Judeo-Masonic CIA conspiracy snatched it out of his hands.

Like Dostoevsky wrote, “the line between good and evil runs through the human heart.” I also think that the line between intelligence and stupidity runs through the human heart (head?) as well and this intelligence divide doesn't run along the lines of national borders.

It is what it is.

My opponent, Ed Reins:

Concerning Kosovo: the moment Ukraine’s legitimately elected government was ousted, the Ukraine has stopped to exist as a lawful entity. Crimea’s independence or its annexation by Russia was left to the people. In Kosovo, the Yugoslavian government was not overthrown. Therefore, their territorial integrity had to be preserved. The annexation of Crimea is not a violation, because US backed thugs have destroyed Ukraine as a country first. One might argue that it was the rest of Ukraine that went rogue, not Crimea.

On the other subject: I am very familiar with the educational system in the US. According to a recent poll by the Time Magazine, 37% of Americans can’t find US on the map. US Ph.D. program in Math or Engineering starts with courses studied in Russia in the first year of College. In Russia, 2 semester of Calculus are required for a High School graduation. They are not required even for the US Bachelor’s degree. My 12 year old son can solve in his head, while playing video games, the math problems the best American Senior students can’t do after hours of trying. A friend of mine, who is an educated American computer scientist, thought Luxembourg was a republic of the former USSR. The list goes on. Look up “Stupid in America” on yandex. A lot of videos will pop up, which are fun to watch. The dumbing down of the US educational system is a way for the government to control the masses. In US, the work requiring high level of hard science or math expertise is always done by foreigners.


In US you have to ask for a permission to put up security bars in your own house and if you don’t trim your bushes, they will do it for you and send you a bill. The US is a fascist police state at its worst. I travelled the world, but I have never been to a country with less freedom than US.

The Nazi Germany has placed itself outside of the family of nations by its own oppressive, murderous and genocidal policies, not unlike those of the USA today. Therefore, it was not a violation of an international law when Germany was partitioned and occupied by the Allies. Similarly, when Ukraine’s new government came to power, even by more illegitimate means than those of Hitler, who didn’t need a coup d’etat, and when it proclaimed its affinity to the Hitler’s ideology, calling for another Holocaust, making new laws prohibiting the use of Russian language and Russian language TV’s, murdering peaceful demonstrators, calling on Doku Umarov to commit terrorist acts, calling for building nuclear bombs to be used against Russia, etc., it placed itself in the same position as a Nazi Germany. Therefore, it is totally legitimate now to break Ukraine into independent regions and it is OK for Russia, as the only country capable of stopping the Nazis, to invade and put this regime down.

Ivan: 

Hitler got a plurality of votes in that fatal German election but he didn't have the majority. The majority of votes belonged to an unrealized coalition of Social Democrats and German communists. But one tough Kremlin fella who named himself after a metal didn't want German communists working with Social Dems.

Stalin didn't want to share the proletarian German banner with an uncontrolled bourgeois party; he was expecting for the German state under Hitler to implode and for the reds to seize power in Berlin through an old school revolution.

Hitler got his parliamentary alliance from conservative parties who through they could control him- bummer that they couldn't. Hitler sent communists to concentration camps, took over the army and after president Hindenburg croaked the conservative parties had no institutional support and became completely irrelevant.

Then the fuhrer started a racist war for living space and ended up killing over 20 million Russians as well as millions of others in one of the bloodies chapters in human history that is pointless to recount because everyone knows the basic outline from Hollywood movies or other sources.

If you glance at that horrible picture and see parallels with American influence in central Europe than… well, let’s just say we have a difference of opinion.

America is a global power. Russia is a regional power with global influence. Powerful countries routinely violate international law and piss off other centers of power.

That’s what makes them powerful. Power in politics is doing things others don’t like. But a power country doing something you dislike doesn't mean we’re back in the Third Reich.

You can be like the trolls saying “Putler this, Putler that.. The future of free Europe is at stake… blah, blah, blah” except on the other side of the Crimean barricades, but this Americanized Ivan is not interested.

I’m really tired of lazy WW2 analogies. Another Hitler reference will make me start cutting myself and listening to Pussy Riot before I am sent off to the asylum for Russian expats in Ohio.

Putin doesn't even have a mustache but neither does Samantha Powers and even (the GREAT, the POWERFUL) Victoria Nuland doesn't show any signs of facial hair.

US and Russia have their own interests and they clashed in Ukraine. As a Russian in America I can appreciate Russian position and don’t view it as a caricature, a macho joke or a sinister imperialist plot. But I don’t think the Americans who do, do so because of some media/government conspiracy.

Their ideas about Russian power come from the Cold War; and when the bear rises, Cold War is what many see. I don’t agree but that’s the way it is. I provide my alternative vision on my blog where all three of my loyal readers can get a different perspective on things. So far the Masonic rulers of the world have not poisoned my little well of freedom…

Ukraine is an ideologically divided country with different world powers betting on different ideological forces.

There is the liberal, pro-EU contingent allied with the semi-authoritarian, Bandera-loving, ultra-nationalist forces. Then there is the vaguely pro-Russian contingent that wants an independent Ukraine in the Russian sphere and then there are those who warm the hearts in the Kremlin waiving Russian flags in Donetsk- they want the motherland and they want her NOW.

The bummer about revolutions is that they radicalize everyone. The revolutionary comes to power in an illegal way through the use of force. Then rationally the first goal of a successful revolutionary is to prevent others from getting the same idea. So they suppress dissents. The Menshiviks could tell you a lot about this process… alas, they were all shot by Lenin and Stalin.

The new revolutionary government in Ukraine has put together a new National Guard. Although they don’t say it bluntly, the Ukrainian National Guard is an attempt to create a militarized force to protect the new government because they don’t trust the army or the old security forces, especially since so many defected to the Russians in Crimea.

Now the Ukrainian economy is falling apart and the eastern part of the country faces a potential visa regime with neighboring Russia where they have relatives, those Russian-speaking Ukrainians had their language threatened, had the president they elected overthrown and had oligarchs appointed to “pacify them.”

No they're not happy, but when I look at the East of Ukraine I see a human tragedy not an opportunity for geopolitical games. I think a Russian invasion you propose to remove the new government isn't going to make things better. Whether you like it or not, some people in Ukraine do support the new regime and are willing to die for it. Let alone the fact that an escalation could bring the world to a brink of war between nuclear powers.

Then again, I don’t know you so perhaps a WW3 would give new meaning to your life.

In the aftermath of this Slavic adventure, we can all build a real Third Rome in Moscow out of nuclear ash.

The three-eyed Orthodox priests will bless mutated, three-armed Russian patriots with radioactive holy water and the post-war mutant Nato will work on its controversial missile defense system in Poland- only this time they will be guarding against Russia’s advanced flying stick technology and an occasional rock (only if Kremlin’s interest are REALLY disrespected will we resort to throwing rocks at Poland).

But Ukraine… THERMONUCLEAR UKRAINE WILL BE OURS!!!

No comments:

Post a Comment